mailing list archives

We've always gone on the assumption that you should be able to ask for STATUS on any mailbox returned in a LIST response.  The new Gmail IMAP implementation doesn't seem to play that way -- they have a base \NoSelect mailbox that's returned from LIST but that returns NO on STATUS:

   A3 LIST "" "*"
   * LIST () "/" "INBOX"
   * LIST () "/" "Trash"
   * LIST (\Noselect) "/" "[Gmail]"
   * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/All Mail"
   * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/Drafts"
   * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/Sent Mail"
   * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/Spam"
   * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/Starred"
   * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/Trash"
   A3 OK Success 

   A6 STATUS [Gmail] (UIDVALIDITY)
   A6 NO Invalid folder: [Gmail] (Failure)

Is this acceptable server behavior?

UW imapd has always returned NO if you attempt a STATUS command on a 
\NoSelect name.  Thus, I consider such behavior acceptable and correct.

The idea of "\NoSelect mailbox" is the problem; that's an oxymoron. 
IMHO, a mailbox, by definition, does not have \NoSelect associated with 
its name.

Following that reasoning, LIST does not return mailboxes, but instead 
returns names; and that the names that do not have \NoSelect are 
mailboxes.

On Wed, 24 Oct 2007, Dan Karp wrote:
> We've always gone on the assumption that you should be able to ask for 
> STATUS on any mailbox returned in a LIST response.  The new Gmail IMAP 
> implementation doesn't seem to play that way -- they have a base 
> \NoSelect mailbox that's returned from LIST but that returns NO on 
> STATUS:
>
>   A3 LIST "" "*"
>   * LIST () "/" "INBOX"
>   * LIST () "/" "Trash"
>   * LIST (\Noselect) "/" "[Gmail]"
>   * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/All Mail"
>   * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/Drafts"
>   * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/Sent Mail"
>   * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/Spam"
>   * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/Starred"
>   * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/Trash"
>   A3 OK Success
>
>   A6 STATUS [Gmail] (UIDVALIDITY)
>   A6 NO Invalid folder: [Gmail] (Failure)
>
> Is this acceptable server behavior?

-- Mark --

http://panda.com/mrc
Democracy is two wolves and a sheep deciding what to eat for lunch.
Liberty is a well-armed sheep contesting the vote.

On Wed Oct 24 13:34:05 2007, Dan Karp wrote:
> We've always gone on the assumption that you should be able to ask  
> for STATUS on any mailbox returned in a LIST response.  The new  
> Gmail IMAP implementation doesn't seem to play that way -- they  
> have a base \NoSelect mailbox that's returned from LIST but that  
> returns NO on STATUS:
> 
> 
I'm in agreement with Mark, but I would point out that in this case,  
GMail is behaving badly:


>    A3 LIST "" "*"
>    * LIST () "/" "INBOX"
>    * LIST () "/" "Trash"
>    * LIST (\Noselect) "/" "[Gmail]"
>    * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/All Mail"
>    * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/Drafts"
>    * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/Sent Mail"
>    * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/Spam"
>    * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/Starred"
>    * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/Trash"
>    A3 OK Success 
> 
That [Gmail] heirarchy point shouldn't be listed here - as Mark says,  
it's not a mailbox, therefore shouldn't match.

It should be returned for LIST "" "%", but not LIST "" "*".

Dave.
-- 
Dave Cridland - mailto:dave@cridland.net - xmpp:dwd@jabber.org
  - acap://acap.dave.cridland.net/byowner/user/dwd/bookmarks/
  - http://dave.cridland.net/
Infotrope Polymer - ACAP, IMAP, ESMTP, and Lemonade

> I'm in agreement with Mark, but I would point out that in this case, 
> GMail is behaving badly:
> 
> >    A3 LIST "" "*"
> >    * LIST () "/" "INBOX"
> >    * LIST () "/" "Trash"
> >    * LIST (\Noselect) "/" "[Gmail]"
> >    * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/All Mail"
> >    * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/Drafts"
> >    * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/Sent Mail"
> >    * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/Spam"
> >    * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/Starred"
> >    * LIST () "/" "[Gmail]/Trash"
> >    A3 OK Success 
> 
> That [Gmail] heirarchy point shouldn't be listed here - as Mark says, 
> it's not a mailbox, therefore shouldn't match.
> 
> It should be returned for LIST "" "%", but not LIST "" "*".

Why?  RFC 3501 section 6.3.4 has the following example:

   Examples:   C: A682 LIST "" *
               S: * LIST () "/" blurdybloop
               S: * LIST (\Noselect) "/" foo
               S: * LIST () "/" foo/bar

On Wed, 24 Oct 2007, Dave Cridland wrote:
> That [Gmail] heirarchy point shouldn't be listed here - as Mark says, it's 
> not a mailbox, therefore shouldn't match.
>
> It should be returned for LIST "" "%", but not LIST "" "*".

I disagree.  It depends upon the semantics of the underlying mail store.

In some mail stores, such as Cyrus, there is no such physical object as a 
"directory" (which is typically what a \NoSelect name is); that is, a 
bucket that holds mailboxes and other directories.  In others, such as the 
ones typically exported by UW, there is such a physical object.

IMAP does NOT, repeat NOT!! dictate the semantics of the server's mail 
store; rather, it provides a means to export the mail store's semantics.

-- Mark --

http://panda.com/mrc
Democracy is two wolves and a sheep deciding what to eat for lunch.
Liberty is a well-armed sheep contesting the vote.